Chairman of Madhesi Janadhikar Forum-Loktantrik Bijay Kumar Gachhadar had played an important role to nudge the three major parties towards a 16-point agreement. He has now walked out on the alliance, accusing the major parties of ignoring his advice to have eight provinces to address the demands of most of the agitating groups. Madhav Ghimire and Abdesh Kumar Jha spoke to Gachhadar on Tuesday during his visit to his home district to take part in a programme. Excerpts:

When will the constitution be promulgated?

A draft has been presented at the Constituent Assembly (CA) and the constitution-making process is underway. Now this will either fail or succeed. My wish is to see a constitution drafted through the CA. Thousands have shed blood. And this is the culmination of 65 year-old process. The process is now in its final lap. This will end a long period of conflict and instability. In order to maintain national unity, there is no alternative to promulgating a constitution from the CA. The constitution will be promulgated in the third or fourth week of September. For the sake of agreement, a week here and there should be acceptable.

The issue of demarcation is still controversial. Is this the only reason why there are protests across the country?

Federal system, number of provinces, and demarcation have been a key reason why we have failed to finalise the new constitution for eight years. The 16-point agreement among the four parties paved the way forward. We had agreed to federate the country into eight provinces. But suddenly six-province model was floated. I had written a note of dissent, arguing that the six-province model won’t resolve the disputes,  yet the process was pushed forward. I had drawn the attention of major leaders that it would lead to strong protest. The protest started from the West. Then I tried to convince major party leaders that even the seven-province model  isn’t the right solution. None of the leaders could explain to me how seven provinces were decided. I had urged them to go for eight provinces and even submitted an outline. But major parties ignored my suggestion. The protests you are seeing now is the direct result of that.

Number of provinces have kept on changing from eight, six and now to seven. Why is this?

If the leaders had stuck to the 16-point agreement, that would have been ideal. I had advised major leaders against ignoring the demands of population living in major parts of the country. If the attitudes continue to harden on the ground, this could lead to a civil war. Myopia of the three parties is pushing the country towards a dangerous path. Despite all these, petty self-interests became the sole basis to demarcate the country.

Out of 26.4 million population, 13.5 million live in Tarai. I see a danger of civil war in federating the country without addressing the demands being raised in Tarai. Again, petty self-interests of three major parties continue to dominate the way decisions are made.

What are these interests?

KP Oli and Krishna Sitaula’s interests are linked to Jhapa district, while Sher Bahadur Deuba and others have an interest in keeping Kailali and Kanchanpur undivided.  Even UCPN (Maoist) Chairman Pushpa Kamal Dahal supported these positions.

What is the solution then?

Eight-province model is the solution. Three in Tarai and five in the Hill. If this happens, over 90 percent of the parties in the CA will support the new constitution. A new amendment will have to be registered, incorporating the demands of Madhesis, Tharus, Adivasis and Janajatis. A constitution should only be promulgated after this revision. This will be an unmistakeable solution.

You could have proposed his amendment yourself.

Yes, I could have. But I didn’t get any indication that the Big Three were positive on this. The situation is such that I cannot trust them. From today (Tuesday), discussion on the amendment proposal has started. We are not participating in this. The Big Three should understand that the whole Tarai—Tharu, Muslims, Adivasis and Janjatis— is opposed to the current draft.

Madhesi leaders have claimed that your alliance has been formed to split the opposition protest.

Key Madhesi leaders have repeatedly asked me to join hands with them. This in itself explains the importance of our coalition. Yes, there are some leaders who are extremely biased against me and feel threatened by my mere presence, that this will somehow undermine their own standing. Perhaps this is why they have been speaking out against me. There are many other smaller parties who want to joint our front. We can only admit them once we have discussed it in the party and in our alliance. We will start our protest very soon. Our decision to join hands with parties that are currently agitating will be based on our reading of the unfolding situation.

Indefinite banda and protest have already badly affected normal life. So you want to organise more protest?

During the peaceful protest of last 25 days, 29 people have lost their lives, including a senior ranking police officer. The state is determined to stamp out even peaceful protest. For that reason, the banda has prolonged, daily life in Tarai has been badly affected, and different districts have become like war zones. But the establishment does not consider this as a protest. For this reason, we need a robust protest which will force the state to listen to the protesters.

There is no indication that talks would begin and life would return to normal. Why is this?

Tarai and Madhes are integral part of the country and the people living there should be treated with respect and dignity. Not just Tharus and Madhesis, even other indigenous groups are in protest. If the movement for protection of identity and rights is ignored, this will be fatal for the country. This can quickly lead to revolt of a different kind. Three party leaders need to reflect on this with seriousness.

What kind of revolt?

If the dissatisfaction increases, the movement will continue as well. This will worsen the already bad situation. This can lead to secessionist ideas. So before it is too late, major parties need to think hard on this.

How concerned are the diplomatic community as the rift widens on constitution?

After the 16-point agreement was reached, I received many congratulatory messages from EU, USA, UN and other diplomatic missions. They appreciated my role in bringing the three parties together to an agreement. But the three leaders have ignored my advice.